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 Post subject: Re: ASK DR. NIMAN
PostPosted: Fri Nov 06, 2009 2:28 pm 
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Can normal birds in nature get this pandemic H1N1 2009 flu ?
I thought it could, but i'm not sure...

H1N1 Netherlands

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 Post subject: Re: ASK DR. NIMAN
PostPosted: Fri Nov 06, 2009 5:39 pm 
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H1N1 Netherlands wrote:
Can normal birds in nature get this pandemic H1N1 2009 flu ?
I thought it could, but i'm not sure...

H1N1 Netherlands

Swine H1N1 is call a permiscuous virus because it can easily jump species. It is a virus that normally transmits in swine. Last spring it jumped to humans, which raised the possibility that the virus could easily jump from species to species. This was confimed when human infected turkeys in Chile and Canada. It was furtehr confirmed when H1N1 was identified in pet ferrets and a pet cat. It is also likley in dogs as well as many additional species. Thefore, in view of the jump from humans to turkeys, it should be able to jump to many or most bird species.

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 Post subject: Re: ASK DR. NIMAN
PostPosted: Fri Nov 06, 2009 6:11 pm 
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niman wrote:
H1N1 Netherlands wrote:
Can normal birds in nature get this pandemic H1N1 2009 flu ?
I thought it could, but i'm not sure...

H1N1 Netherlands

Swine H1N1 is call a permiscuous virus because it can easily jump species. It is a virus that normally transmits in swine. Last spring it jumped to humans, which raised the possibility that the virus could easily jump from species to species. This was confimed when human infected turkeys in Chile and Canada. It was furtehr confirmed when H1N1 was identified in pet ferrets and a pet cat. It is also likley in dogs as well as many additional species. Thefore, in view of the jump from humans to turkeys, it should be able to jump to many or most bird species.


Thank you very much for this clear answer Dr. Niman

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 Post subject: Re: ASK DR. NIMAN
PostPosted: Sun Nov 08, 2009 4:41 pm 
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Dr Niman, I see that sequences from Mill Hill are overdue. Has this happened before during this pandemic and how long does it normally take them to sequence and release the data?

Thank you in advance for whenever you are able to reply - I know you must be extremely busy right now.


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 Post subject: Re: ASK DR. NIMAN
PostPosted: Sun Nov 08, 2009 5:43 pm 
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Hi Dr. Niman. Can you explain, like you would to a three year old, how it is possible to gain immunity from the vaccination and yet not get immunity from actually having the virus? I mean if you can get H1N1 more than once surely you can get it after having the vaccination.... Doesn't seem to make much sense to me. Thanks!

(reposted here , the correct place, as suggested)


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 Post subject: Re: ASK DR. NIMAN
PostPosted: Sun Nov 08, 2009 7:37 pm 
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Given sufficient funding for research and testing, would we be able to be tested for our own viral loads, to know how much immunity we had?

Also would we have custom tailored vaccines per our weight size, as someone asked elsewhere?


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 Post subject: Re: ASK DR. NIMAN
PostPosted: Mon Nov 09, 2009 12:39 am 
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Faithful asked:

Quote:
I would like to know why ferrets and cats and whatnot are being tested for H1N1 while our children are denied the test?



Perhaps I can try to give an answer. Dr. Niman can correct it if I am wrong.

People are interested in knowing whether or not vaccine is reaching at-risk populations (as defined by the CDC) before others like hockey players, Goldman-Sachs, CitiGroup employees, county health employees who don't interface with the public, etc. If some groups are "jumping the queue", we may be outraged. I think what you are saying is that if swine flu tests are not being done for most people, testing a pet cat is like placing a higher value on a cat than a child, and that seems wrong.

However, it is very important to know when viruses are "jumping species". There should have been more surveillance testing of pigs and poultry raised as farm animals on an ongoing basis (hindsight is easy). Then researchers would be more certain where h1n1 originated and when it jumped species to humans.

After h1n1 was widely circulating, reports emerged about h1n1 virus in pigs on farms and at fairs, and in turkeys in Chile and Canada. Then there were reports about ferrets used as test-subjects for flu, and then reports about pet ferrets contracting flu.

When a family brought their sick cat in to the vet, he ruled out some likely cat illnesses and said that this cat's symptoms didn't look like typical cat pneumonia, but knowing that the family had been sick with the swine flu, it was logical to wonder if the cat might be infected. It is of value to know what species of animals can contract flu and whether it passes easily between them. What if we thought that we are approaching a level of herd immunity, based on the percentage of people who have either had the swine flu or received a vaccine, and never realized that it could spread efficiently among cats, dogs, pet birds, who knows? I am in favor of some surveillance testing like this vet did in order to find out.

From this NY Times account: http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/11/0 ... swine-flu/
Quote:
….the cat arrived at the veterinary school, where he was seen by Dr. Jergens, a small animal specialist and immunologist. Upon examination, it appeared the cat had a respiratory condition, so Dr. Jergens performed a bronchial lavage, injecting fluid in and out of the lungs to collect cells to determine what was making the animal sick.
“It didn’t reveal anything that was consistent with what we typically see with pneumonia in a cat,” Dr. Sponseller said.
Although cats can contract flu from birds, this cat never left the house and was never exposed to any other pet. At that point, it occurred to the veterinarians that since the family members had been recently ill, they might be seeing a case of flu transmitted from human to cat. The school is the site of a major diagnostic lab, so the veterinarians were able to test the cat and quickly confirm he had H1N1, a finding that was later confirmed by additional testing by the U.S. Department of Agriculture.


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 Post subject: Re: ASK DR. NIMAN
PostPosted: Mon Nov 09, 2009 3:29 am 
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Is Tamiflu being rationed in the US?

My son with a history of viral-induced asthma tested positive for Type A influenza in a rapid test performed at a hospital here in Texas. I received a Tamiflu prescription because he is an "at risk" patient. The emergency room doctor said they are not writing scrips for non at risk patients. We've got 4 other kids -- called the pediatrician and got the same answer -- would prescribe Tamiflu for my one-year-old because falls within "at risk", but only when she showed symptoms. Two other kids who are showing symptoms would not be given Tamiflu.

I called my doctor since I'm starting to feel symptoms, and got the same message. No Tamiflu for me.

My sister in Chicago had a flu-positive kid this week. Was told by doctors that each individual can get only one Tamiflu prescription every 6 months. (She has other kids including an infant and needs to decide whether she wants to pre-emptively put any other kid on Tamiflu).

CVS could not fill the prescription for my son because they only had adult dosages on hand. Sent me to an independent pharmacist who could "composite" the lower dose.

This contrasts with 4 months ago, when my asmathic child had been exposed to a Type A positive and had typical flu symptoms. I had no problem getting Tamiflu prescriptions for all my kids at one time -- including ones that weren't yet showing symptoms.

BTW, my asthmatic son has been diagnosed with pneumonia 4 times in the last year or so and hospitalized twice, so clearly in the high risk camp.

Anyone else seeing/hearing stories like these?


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 Post subject: Re: ASK DR. NIMAN
PostPosted: Mon Nov 09, 2009 9:52 am 
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Bonesetter Brown wrote:
Is Tamiflu being rationed in the US?

My son with a history of viral-induced asthma tested positive for Type A influenza in a rapid test performed at a hospital here in Texas. I received a Tamiflu prescription because he is an "at risk" patient. The emergency room doctor said they are not writing scrips for non at risk patients. We've got 4 other kids -- called the pediatrician and got the same answer -- would prescribe Tamiflu for my one-year-old because falls within "at risk", but only when she showed symptoms. Two other kids who are showing symptoms would not be given Tamiflu.

I called my doctor since I'm starting to feel symptoms, and got the same message. No Tamiflu for me.

My sister in Chicago had a flu-positive kid this week. Was told by doctors that each individual can get only one Tamiflu prescription every 6 months. (She has other kids including an infant and needs to decide whether she wants to pre-emptively put any other kid on Tamiflu).

CVS could not fill the prescription for my son because they only had adult dosages on hand. Sent me to an independent pharmacist who could "composite" the lower dose.

This contrasts with 4 months ago, when my asmathic child had been exposed to a Type A positive and had typical flu symptoms. I had no problem getting Tamiflu prescriptions for all my kids at one time -- including ones that weren't yet showing symptoms.

BTW, my asthmatic son has been diagnosed with pneumonia 4 times in the last year or so and hospitalized twice, so clearly in the high risk camp.

Anyone else seeing/hearing stories like these?


I don't have the answer to your question but a pharmacist might. Mine told me exactly how many dosages were in the warehouse and how many prescriptions he'd been filling. He also told me that ALL pharmacists have instructions from Roche how to compound the adult Tamiflu into the child's dose.


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 Post subject: Re: ASK DR. NIMAN
PostPosted: Mon Nov 09, 2009 1:21 pm 
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Joined: Mon Nov 09, 2009 1:53 am
Posts: 4
VJP wrote:
Bonesetter Brown wrote:
Is Tamiflu being rationed in the US?

My son with a history of viral-induced asthma tested positive for Type A influenza in a rapid test performed at a hospital here in Texas. I received a Tamiflu prescription because he is an "at risk" patient. The emergency room doctor said they are not writing scrips for non at risk patients. We've got 4 other kids -- called the pediatrician and got the same answer -- would prescribe Tamiflu for my one-year-old because falls within "at risk", but only when she showed symptoms. Two other kids who are showing symptoms would not be given Tamiflu.

I called my doctor since I'm starting to feel symptoms, and got the same message. No Tamiflu for me.

My sister in Chicago had a flu-positive kid this week. Was told by doctors that each individual can get only one Tamiflu prescription every 6 months. (She has other kids including an infant and needs to decide whether she wants to pre-emptively put any other kid on Tamiflu).

CVS could not fill the prescription for my son because they only had adult dosages on hand. Sent me to an independent pharmacist who could "composite" the lower dose.

This contrasts with 4 months ago, when my asmathic child had been exposed to a Type A positive and had typical flu symptoms. I had no problem getting Tamiflu prescriptions for all my kids at one time -- including ones that weren't yet showing symptoms.

BTW, my asthmatic son has been diagnosed with pneumonia 4 times in the last year or so and hospitalized twice, so clearly in the high risk camp.

Anyone else seeing/hearing stories like these?


I don't have the answer to your question but a pharmacist might. Mine told me exactly how many dosages were in the warehouse and how many prescriptions he'd been filling. He also told me that ALL pharmacists have instructions from Roche how to compound the adult Tamiflu into the child's dose.



VJP thanks for the reply. My stories were from yesterday the 8th. I did speak with the CVS pharmacist about availability of doses. He indicated that there was a shortage of child dosages from the supplier, that this CVS only had adult dosages on hand, and they did not have the ability to compound. That's why they sent me to another pharmacist.


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