Rhiza Labs FluTracker Forum

First I don't speak for the map, Niman or anyone else but considering the number of hospital admissions, intensive care patients and deaths then either you do have a very high number of infections as listed in suspected cases or else you have a tremendously high Case Fatality Rate and that is VERY, VERY, VERY bad news. Which do you prefer?

Hopefully things will become clearer soon and I for one hope there are lots of infected people (to lower the CFR), not fewer.

By the way most countries combine an "Influenza Like Illness" diagnosis for their charts which will include a multitude of viral causes so Ukraine is not unusual here. But we are in the middle of a global pandemc so a huge increase in these cases in an area to epidemic levels is most likely to be pandemic H1N1 until shown otherwise.

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[color=#000080]assuming you're open-minded and want to hear the other side of the story,here's the link..[/color] http://www.youtube.com/connectingdots1

High Case Fatality Rate it IS very bad news. But as for your question I would prefer to be properly informed. If the map would include information in the same way as you have posted it:
"Latest Ukranian update shows for Lviv Region

89669 cases of ARI/FLU
2120 Hospital Admissions
29 Deaths"
THEN I would not even consider creating separate Topic, asking question, etc. This explanation for those numbers would be clear enough: Death is High, number of cases for Region is High, lots of Hospital Admissions.

But the numbers, and description information ARE MISLEADING. I still am not aware were current numbers were taken from, what are the 7 reports mentioned, were is the source of this information, AND, which is far more important, the description for Numbers shown in a current way PRESUMES that there is Confirmed/Probable Cases of N1H1: 78131

Can you agree with such an presumption? I cannot. And this is So so so so FAR stretched.

All I am asking is to show actual description for Numbers taken from Official report. If that is ARI, to say: these cases are with ARI, if influenza - say it is X Influenza cases. And the rest Presumptions can be left for people themselves. I mean as for me I am not even sure from the report that these 24 deathes are from N1H1, neither are the officials. Are you sure? Or The one who posts information to map?

Give information as it is, or else say that is information is my Own Opinion. In all other cases you are just misleading people.




This is what I have said about Presumptions. As for me until it is confirmed that there is a lot of people actually ill with H1N1 no one should add ARI and Flu illnesses to this case. For example because the number of people ill on Influenza and ARI is High every Autumn-Winter season in Ukraine. This year is just not an exception.

Yes it is an exception. Your health ministry put out a bulletin on October 2st stating that epidemic threshold was crossed on October 20th in the Ternopil Region. Nationwide influenza activity is just starting to rise above background but the wost hit regions have shown up in Ukranian Health Ministry Surveillance for two weeks now. The official rate is over 300 per 10 thousand population right now in the worst hit areas. Take it up with the Ukranian Government if you disagree.

The latest data is at http://www.moz.gov.ua/ua/main/press/?docID=13950

What on earth do you think all these people are being admitted to hospital with if it isn't pandemic H1N1?

Please take a look at the Header of the Table on the site You are referencing at. It says: "Information on the incidence of influenza, acute respiratory infections and their complications (pneumonia, etc.)" This is what people are hospitalized with. Do you see any information about H1N1 in that table?

Your health minister states there is an H1N1 epidemic and nothing else. Obviously some of these cases will not be H1N1 but please suggest what else has raised the figures to severe epidemic level if not H1N1? It is normal and expected for the swine epidemic to raise related figures other than just "lab confirmed" cases. The same figures are being widely reported in the Ukranian media.

http://translate.google.com/translate?u ... ndows-1251

Dear Sirs,

As Minister of Health of Ukraine, as a doctor and a national appeal to you upon request and refrain from forcing the near future situation in the country, create panic and spread unprofessional medical recommendations in the media.

Today, the state faces serious tests. The epidemic of influenza A/H1N1 California, which syahla territory of our country, requires specialized, coordinated action by all branches of government. However, events of recent days showed that the complicated situation opponents used solely for political struggle and unconstructive criticism.

Charge of the Ministry of alleged financial abuse, I consider an attempt to paralyze the activities of specialists of Health, which now depends on coordination to combat the epidemic of influenza. As Minister of Health sworn facilitate any inspection, investigation, prosecution, but after a flu epidemic in the country be overcome.

Also, ask the politicians, even those who have medical education, to refrain from comments and advice from television screens in the epidemic of influenza A/H1N1 California. After all the political rhetoric around health topics encourages journalists to apply to the MOH for the comments. This, in turn, takes away valuable time refuting absurdities and clarifications specialized medical topics.

Gentlemen policy, everyone should do his thing! Take care of your precious time of doctors, they save the lives of compatriots!

Thank you for understanding

Yes, I have read the original (not an Google translation) of the same article. Ant it sayes nothing else then:
Епідемія грипу A/H1N1 Каліфорнія, яка сягла території нашої держави, вимагає фахових, скоординованих дій всіх гілок влади.
Epidemic of Influenza A/H1N1 California, which reached the territory of our country, requires specialized, coordinated action by all branches of government.

Minister just states that epidemic reached our country. It is not even officially cofirmed that these deathes were caused by H1N1 in the first place. People died because of hard pneumonia. And even when this will be officialy confirmed it does not mean that all 80000, or maybe bigger number at that time, are ill on H1N1.

And Minister also said: "As Minister of Health of Ukraine, as a doctor and a national appeal to you upon request and refrain from forcing the near future situation in the country, create panic and spread unprofessional medical recommendations in the media."
FluTracker map makes everything opposite to that what was asked by Minister. Every 1 of 10 people is ill with N1H1 in Lviv? Is that true?
GIVE A PROPER INFORMATION with PROPER Description if you are WILLING TO SPREAD INFORMATION. DO NOT MISINTERPRET IN THE WAY YOU WANT.

Anyway our current discussion leads to nowhere, as you are not authorized person that can talk as FluTracker representative, and nothing changes in the map. It still shows 4 Confirmed/Probable Cases for Warsaw, Poland and 78131 Confirmed/Probable Cases in Lviv. It seems Like NO ONE is ill in Warsaw with standart influenza or ARI. But in comparison all 78131 cases in Lviv are of N1H1. I would laugh out of such unprofessional way of interpreting data, if it would not be the case of death matters.

That was your initial point and it was established that the figure was for the Lviv Region with a population of 2.5 million and not just the city so you know that is not true. Latest government update is 90000 ill so that would be about 3.5% suspected infected not 1 in 10. Perhaps if you weren't so downright confrontational you might get a response from the map makers.

And further more I want to repeat that I hope these very large suspected numbers and more are actually swine H1N1. If not then something unknown on top of a declared swine epidemic is making folk very seriously ill and killing them at an enormous rate (if you count only "flu" and not ARI/etc). You seem to think the second option is more likely. If you are right then we might all be very, very screwed.

So then is it so hard to change that in a map?

Again your are misinterpreting government information. 90000 of ill on influenza, ARI and other illnesses, but not ill with N1H1 only. Why that differs I have already explained in previous posts, for example in the last one were Warsaw is given as a comparison.
FluTracker information is just misleading. This I hope is clear to everyone that will make comparisons, and will actually read sources (if only that would be included into the map info)
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This is what is not serious at all. I said something uneasy for map makers so that's why I wont get my lollipop. This is khmm...
I do not want anything for me in this case. Just for map makers to show information at least the same way it is interpreted in source. Please